[00:00:00] Hello, hello, and welcome to a very special episode of our pop culture podcast, the awful, awesome entertainment rap. And, uh, for the first time, I think we have traveled outside the studio to interview the new pop culture phenomena of India. Shalini Pasi, did I pronounce that correctly? Yes, but I'm surprised I'm the pop culture.

How can that be? You tell me because my questions are all about that. Oh, wow. Okay. Popular culture. Wow. Amazing. So, first of all, for making the time. And, um, I see that you have a busy schedule. You had an interview before this. Your life changed dramatically after the show? No, I've always been very busy. I like to do things back to back and I enjoy that pace of things because I don't want my mind to be like going on to things that, you know, I like the, I like the pace.

I see. So I'm mostly busy. If, if you would not be [00:01:00] shooting me, I would be shooting myself . Really? For what? Yeah, for anything. For like maybe a travel magazine or an art interview or my personal page, or just for records, because, uh, I actually, I saw in an interview you said that, um, ideally you would like to do a show on travel.

Yeah. And, uh, since that was not happening, this show came along and you said yes to that. Yes, yes. Yeah. So. So I used to make a travel show, by the way, it was called a highway on my plate, but it was. Dhabas, you know, roadside dhabas, you think you would have been interested in something like that? Of course, when I was traveling, uh, from, uh, from Leh to Pangong Lake, we would stop in, um, they were not dhabas actually because they are so high up you cannot call them.

They're just Maggie points. They're Maggie points. And many of them are actually run by the Indian army, because they also you have to check your past there. And the army sort of monitors who's actually going through them. So you get tea [00:02:00] and Maggie and biscuits, which is very rare. You eat that considering what I watched of the show, you're so particular about what I eat.

So I actually, I, my diet which I have is because I want to, uh, that's for nutrients. Raw food. Raw food is for, but I. Raw food consumed and cut immediately, not stored. Mostly, mostly. And if it's. If I have to store it, then of course we make it into a soup or a pulp form. But, uh, the, I I, I work out a lot and I have a very active lifestyle.

So if I were to eat not healthy, also it's, it's not because I want to stay slim, it's because of the benefits it has. Right. So, um, you know, what is it like being, you know, rich and famous as opposed to male rich? Uh, what is it like, uh, what's the difference in the two? What is it? So, for, I, uh, when the series Oh, were you always famous?

It's just, I didn't know. I don't know. Like, [00:03:00] I don't know how people, like, see, I am me. I go about doing what I want to do. And if people are interested or they want to join in, they're most welcome to. You know? And I'm happy to, like, if I, in the art world or the fashion world, I had, like, an audience, and if they loved me, and if I loved what they did So I was interacting with them because that's how we feed off.

Right. They inspire me and I inspire them. Right. That's a very sliver in the stratosphere of, you know, exactly. But the social economic bracket, but now with this show, everybody knows this because of OT, the platform. I did thought I did, uh, I did expect a lot of fame. I did expect fame, not lot, but I thought, yes, people say that, Oh, you did this.

And then like, I was like, Oh my God, is it going to outshadow all the work I've done before, you know, because. For me, I'm giving my 100 percent there also. And I'm giving my time here also. It's not that I've given my more time here. But this has given you more, got you more attention than That this has got me more attention than other things.

Because as we know that the art [00:04:00] community is very small. People who actually understand or enjoy art, it's very less. Cinema is way more. Cricket is way more. And, uh, but I thought there would be fame. But what I was not ready was for the love. Right. Which has been like the most amazing, inspiring thing which I'm getting from people, which I was very pleasantly surprised.

Because I'm not a person that one can decode very easily. And I don't know how the audience is. But no hate? You don't, you don't get any hate? Uh, yes I am. For the pink eye shadow. You go over that because it's not good For the pink eye shadow. For the pink eye shadow, which was actually, you know what happens is when you're shooting, then it's like you're sitting, waiting for the set up and then instead of purple and by accidentally if you put pink in a rush Because the pink and the purple actually write together.

So, you know. So, you've got hate for that. So, I got little bit comments for that came in and then, I think somebody replied she's matching it to the [00:05:00] pink flamingo and, and then I think after the first two, uh, first two, three days, I think there was no comment of, Like some people said that she has too much makeup because you know it was hot and I started sweating and they powdered because my skin shines a lot so they and that all that but the thing is that hi guys I'm shooting like for four five hours we are doing a setup we are doing something else we are waiting you know how it is so And we are not, I'm not a professional, it's my first time being on a different sort of camera.

So that little bit, but then everybody was explaining, the comment came on, and then I think other people were like You know, speaking of comments, I, I, there was this one But so the love which has come in has inspired me. This is what I'm saying. But it's, it's way more than, I mean, I don't know if that's the right word to use, but it's way more love and attention than your more substantial work, which is art and art films.

So does that disappoint you that a reality show gets you more attention than your [00:06:00] substantial work? Did you get the sigh? I did. Yeah. Yeah. Well, my Definitely, that was, I mean, I knew, see, I know. Are you disappointed or disillusioned with society? Not at all, because I knew this is how, this is how things are.

Like, you know, this, I knew that, I always known that, um, Cinema is a view, it's a very powerful medium. And my thing is that I'm not going to see the negative side of it. Like, oh, I did all this, It's in the art, art field, or like, you know, I've been, uh, you know, doing work for UNICEF or my philanthropy work is not got me whatever.

But the thing is that I would like to use, uh, this medium for extending my passions, which is art and design and philanthropy. So I'm looking at it like that now. You know, so I always see the positive side that, you know, that like this is a medium when I can reach people, like whether it's for like women supporting [00:07:00] women, which is very, very close to me, close to my heart, or also like things like art, like Indian contemporary art.

I mean, I know very less about Indian crafts. That's something I want to learn about. But it's so vast that, that even I feel scared like getting a book because I know I'll get it. truly pulled into it. So I also like try to, you know, we can only be effective if we are at various platforms. So where I was before I had reached a glass ceiling in that, because that my audience was just that, the art audience.

What is that audience? The art audience. Delhi's high society. Delhi high society, Bombay high society. Bengal has an art tradition, does it not? Of course. Calcutta? There's every Calcutta, you go everywhere, there are all these art exhibitions, right? Of course, there are art exhibitions everywhere in the world.

And if not, there's art in craft, right? But where are the buyers? The buyers are here in Delhi? I don't know about the buyers. I know about the collectors. Collectors are [00:08:00] based all over the world. There's a lot of interest in the Indian art community. Uh, I've been having people from all over the world who come.

for the, for the India Art Fair, who are my friends and fellow collectors, people from various museums, curators, artists. So that has been my community. Society coming to a society, of course, I am in the society and I love who I am and I love being who I am. So. You didn't say, but you love the people. Of course, I love the people.

They make me. Okay. So, but you know, I get you to saying just while we are recording this It appears Donald Trump will win the election. So clearly, you know, the, the mass attraction to reality shows is way more than anything else. You know. Definitely. The, the larger audience is very much interested in reality.

And that was surprising to me because I often, I often feel that, uh, like, why would you Want to know about another person unless you have, you know, won many [00:09:00] battles or have had a career like MF Hussain, which is like, why would be people be interested in just my life because I've not done anything like, I honestly feel that I'm not like, so why would they want to know about me?

That is one thought, which was always there. And, uh, what I was saying was not just the larger audience. have, uh, sort of reached out, but my own friends and acquaintances who I've known all over the world, there are many friends who, um, they don't understand Hindi and they're not Indian. People from the art and design world have reached out, watched the show.

Uh, this, they have said that we knew, we know about you, we know you, and we met you a few times. We, we've heard that you are like this and you are, but seeing you on the show was very heartwarming. So this is one sort of a thing, which I'm. Very, very grateful for. So, why did you do the show? Like you said that you were surprised that, why are people interested in your life?

It's not like you have done anything. [00:10:00] One is that, why did you do the show? And two, uh, if you were to sell it to someone, as in not like a producer, but if you were to pitch it. One question at a time. Okay, fine. Because I forget the first one then. Okay, the first one then. Why did I do the show? Uh, so I was very keen.

I had a, actually, uh, I had a camera phobia till 2018. Before that I would hate being in front of the camera because I felt that I looked better otherwise than on camera. I've just saw this person was so different. But you do look better otherwise. Yeah, just thank you. I'd look better otherwise, right? But that doesn't mean you don't look good on camera, you just look better off camera as well, right?

Yeah, so I just felt like, you know, I like saw like my, I have a cut here on my eyebrows and like, you know, all that stuff would just suddenly get enhanced. And also in my voice, I just felt like, you know, everybody else had this really amazing voice and style of singing. Speaking. So I said like, God, what am I doing?

So still before 2018, there are barely any pictures of me. Like there are, of course, you know, [00:11:00] at weddings and stuff like that. But I was very away from the cameras as to not like it at all. And then 2018, I thought, you know, let me like, try to get out of it. And then I really started enjoying it. And I wanted to, uh, How did Just being in front of the camera.

Because you had people follow you around the camera. No, no, just shoot and shoot and shoot and shoot and like get used to the idea of seeing yourself through the lens. Rather than just seeing myself in the mirror because that sort of became like a handicap. Because if anybody wanted an interview, we, I would just like, you know, take that one particular picture, make it into black and white or crop it.

Tell my guys, you know, can you not change the color of the outfit? And, and, you know, and reuse it. So this is a time where that same picture has been like twisted and torn and cut. So then I was, uh, I started enjoying it. I got a lot of, um, you know, a lot of my friends, a [00:12:00] lot of the fashion designers, they said, you know, where, like, where that outfit and shoot your, and you're traveling to a wedding or you're traveling to a destination, like if you're going to Turkey, you know, I mean, I had the opportunity to shoot in various palaces and museums when I was in Warsaw.

So, I would travel a lot. And, uh, so then I started doing that, you know. And then I thought that, you know, like, I should do like a travel show on India. And, or a cultural show. So I started shooting a little bit, uh, there, but that didn't, because they said there's no, there's not much audience for a cultural or a travel or art show, but I anyway did it.

I said, let me do it and let's see what happens. So that gave me a lot of confidence. To be in front of the camera in different circumstances, like if it's like this in Bikaner, there was a desert strong, so we are shooting through it and actual the visual which has come out is so stunning because there's a dress which is flowing and there's like you can actually, you know, You know, but the camera was not able [00:13:00] to get clear pictures.

We have videos, then Leh, Ladakh. So what do you do with all this footage? So, uh, so footage, basically I was shooting for, uh, Hello Magazine for sometimes for Harper, sometimes for, uh, Travel Magazine, Travel and Leisure. I did a cover for them. Um, it was also like guest writing articles on, uh, Venice, Biennale, different places.

Different on Freeze for the Freeze magazine. Uh, some international magazines as well. So it was being, it all these pictures were like also like a personal project, but they were also being published that, but they were also being used by smaller publications like art publications or design fashion like that.

So it was quite fulfilling, you know? Mm-Hmm. because they would give their input and safety. This cannot be used because it's like that or, but we wanted this. So then all that also started, you know, going into my mind. Um, so. So it was fun because also why did you do this show? So I did this show because they said there's not much uh, there is not there's no not much scope for [00:14:00] these kind of shows The travel and the art so because this so I thought maybe like if I do this show and I can like You know mauritius

So I said, I'll do the show and it'll be fun because this is a very big audience that they have. And I was very comfortable with, uh, Dramatics. Uh, and of course the girls I had known for a while. So I thought it'll be something, you know. And it's easy because they're coming to Delhi and they're shooting in a space where So just an adventure because there's nothing really in it for you, right?

I mean, it's not like What do you need the show in the sense that It's not like you're looking for a career in showbiz or anything. It's just something you're doing as a love. I need goals. I need goals which are, which keep me challenged to get up from the bed. We'll have to say, today I have like five shoots.

I really need to get up on time. I need to sleep. I need goals. So it's a motivation. I, it's more like like, I've seen people who like say, Achha ye bhi hai, we have this, everything is done. And [00:15:00] they sort of lose that fire. That's all. So for me, it's like I'm working in an industry where mostly people are very, very young and even the, like the camera team or the creative team, everybody is way younger and which is very inspiring for me.

So for me, it's everything that I do is more like I have a goal. I have to do this because life had become like very like, you know, like just like there was no excitement and no goals. I just want to have gold. So how did it get to this? Tell us about your life. Where did you go to school? Where did you go to college?

Like, you were married very young. How old were you when you got married? Twenty. Twenty? Yeah. Oh, wow. Finally a college. Finally a college, yeah. So, uh, Tell us about it. You grew up in Delhi? You're a Delhi girl? Yeah, yeah. Because in your Delhi versus Bombay first of all, that was very confusing because one of those Bombay girls is actually a Delhi girl.

And one of the Delhi girls is actually a Bombay girl. So, I didn't, there was, but we'll come to that later. So, I've said in the show, maybe they haven't. So, I'm, I'm, I'm the only one who's [00:16:00] actually born and, uh, brought up and still in Delhi. Okay. Delhi, Delhi through. I, I can't live anywhere else but here. And you were a diving champion as well, right?

So I used to, in modern, we would do like lots of things. You were in modern Barakamba or VV? Barakamba. Oh, I see, okay. Yeah, Barakamba. So you went to school in Delhi? So I went to school in Delhi and, uh, I thoroughly enjoyed, uh, my time there because we were encouraged through so much. There were so much opportunities that were given to us in school in terms of activities and, uh, What we could, we had some of the best coaches and, you know, they would send us to tournaments, which was quite amazing because, uh, it gave everybody, not just me, but it gave all of us this thing that we could do something like if someone, so there was, they did not encourage like one person to just do everything or they encouraged everybody.

They try to find the, you know, what one can lead in, you know, so each one was of us was given an opportunity. And what is it that you pursued? Because it had great spots. I wanted to study, I wanted to [00:17:00] study art further, but I couldn't. But I continued to take classes at Triveni. And I did a course on fashion design, which I did not finish.

From Delhi? JD, JD Institute, which is just a one year, not two years. But I was doing it side by side with my college. I never got my, uh, degree. I used to go for classes there. I think I got engaged, then I had to travel. So that was, I gave up. And what did you study in college? I studied Jesus and Mary. What, what subject did you do?

I did, uh, I did psychology. In, uh, Chanakya Puri? Yeah. Oh, nice. So you're an out and out daddy girl. Yeah. So my parents wanted me to go to a con, like an all girls college. So then I got accepted. And then you got married. And how was that? I mean, you were young, I guess, was there any adjustment required? Yeah, so my family was very loving and, uh, my in laws were amazing.

And so, but the thing is, obviously, I'd had a life of school and college. And sport. And sport and creativity and the life just revolved around that. So there was, I [00:18:00] mean, while growing up, there was no like, We didn't have like, my mom, my mother was, we didn't have to go to like, you know, like a society, society pressure.

I wouldn't call it pressure. It's, it's, it was fun meeting everybody. But it's a different setup. It's a very different, it's a very different, uh, setup because it's really different. You know, the society actually, Delhi is pretty different. And yeah. So it was coming from a background where, of course, my family was, uh, into business.

But, uh, at heart and at, I was living a lifestyle of an artist, right? Which is very free. So you did not pursue art as a subject after marriage? No, I didn't. I, yes, I continued painting. Okay. But, uh, not, not, uh, I'm not a trained artist, but I Obviously can paint and do. I learned everything till I was in school properly and then after that I continued taking classes like forever.

I said, I'm a learner. So then what were your goals that you set up throughout your life as, as you know, when you were young? So [00:19:00] I. How did the. Caterpillar become this butterfly. But I think that I had many opportunities. I did have, but I didn't take them. So there's always this regret that, you know, I could have done this or that.

And, uh, but now when I, when any opportunity comes. Big or small, I don't say no. Such as? What opportunities came that you didn't take up when you were younger? Younger, many opportunities to, you know, uh, stand up and say, no, I want to do arts, uh, or, you know, stuff like that. What do you mean? Like to stand up, pursue your passion, because you're young and then you like, you don't understand like what, uh, You were shy, you didn't want to, No, the thing is that you, that you just see, okay, this is, it was the easier way out, honestly, like why say it for somebody else.

Going to art school is tough. It's four years. And I knew I would be married like in two or three. So I, it would be difficult for me to actually pursue. So somewhere it was also like one said, achha, this is the easier thing to go to Jesus and Mary and everything, you know. And knowing you're a [00:20:00] good man.

But that's the story of a lot of women in India, right? Who don't pursue their career, their primary passion, because they know. Marriage is gonna take. Yeah. But the thing is that precedence I was what I, what I did not, uh, what I, what people think that it's not suddenly. So what I did not stop doing was that if I loved something or did not even understand, so when, like in the nineties, there was no like Google search and all, so like I would get.

So I would like, I would like go to a place, buy books from there and then carry it back with me. And then every night, every night I would read or see or like flip and keep. I kept studying. I kept studying history of art, art. If I saw some work of a fashion designer and I knew nothing about it, I would write it down at the back of my diary.

We didn't have a phone to add notes, right? At the back of my diary, I had like a diary, you know, write the name of that fashion designer. If I went to that city or I [00:21:00] went, traveled abroad, or if I went to the bookshop, I would say, mujhe ye wale you know, ya. So, you Like, I was not even, I was not learning things that I did not, that I knew, but also I wanted to learn.

So I said, you know what? Like my, my sir always told me that no learning is wasted. So I don't, I say, I don't know where life will take me. I don't know so many things. Let me just keep, so every night, little, little, little far over now, 28 years. And even I do it even now. I have classes. I, I, yeah. So every night I studied.

But now do you assert your preferences? This is what I want to do. And that's why I will do this. No, I think I'm very like, uh, also fluid. I'm also like, I'm also I do a lot of things, you know, and that also is very time consuming. I also do a lot of random things. And at that point, it just seems so nonsensical to everyone else.

But like after five [00:22:00] years, then I'm like, Oh, oh, yeah, I remember doing that. And let's use that for this, you know, So there's always, I know nothing, no time, no energy, nothing is wasted. You can always like, you know, use it. So, um, is, is that why you said in the show that you want to be a boy? So that you could do exactly what you want without any pressure.

Growing up in the nineties, it was like, you know, uh, of course there was like, uh, more pressure, this is your deadline at 5 p. m. is your deadline. You have to be back home at five, uh, whatever. But yeah, of course there was. There was. But now not anymore. I think it's I think it's really amazing. Yeah, right.

Yeah. Okay. And the times have changed people are more accepting worldwide. You see business wise also like women earlier 90s were told to dress dress in a structured jacket. If you want to go to work, don't wear makeup. Uh, where like these muted tones, like there were these [00:23:00] articles in various magazines and uh, I'm sure you recall that too, right?

Sure. But now women, like nobody, I don't see any articles. I don't see women wearing, uh, just pants just to be taken seriously, you know? So that thing where you can explore your individuality, times have changed, like you can wear like a fun printed dress, go to work, and not be judged, ki arre isne, yeh print pehna hai, and the person who is like in a pant and straight colour is more serious.

That notion has gone now. pyjama type people. All the, that notion has gone now, you know. What about white kurta pajama? What does that say about a person? White kurta pajama says a lot. Like, white kurta pajama in Delhi would be a politician or a writer. Killed it for you? Killed it for you? I was looking for what is that actually white.

That would be This is ultra white, man. This is like, ring ki chamkar white, no? Really? Chalo, very good. Okay, but But you're not wearing khadi, no? Also the [00:24:00] fabric, uh, would have a, also like a fabric for like Shalini, I'm actually on matters like this. I'm completely illiterate. I'm art illiterate. I'm, um, fabric illiterate.

So No one is art illiterate because art is everywhere. It is, but I mean, I could never appreciate it. You know You're also very fashionable, I must tell you. And very chic. Thank you. Very chic Indian. Very nice. I really like it. You're very kind. No, I'm not. I'm actually not. But you're, uh I, uh, I, whenever I travel for family or for whatever reason, see relatives, et cetera, I'd never want to go to a museum, but I was told by my sister, you know, don't just go for sports matches and all.

So I went to, um, is it in, uh, Berlin? The Gornika? Gornika kehta na? What is, how do you pronounce it? Berlin, yeah. Uh, Picassos, uh, yeah, it's in Berlin, right? Yeah. So it's a huge thing. It's in weather control. You can't smoke up seat. And then I, Berlin has some of the best museums. Yeah. And then slowly I started really appreciating, uh, [00:25:00] art.

But, uh, but you know, art is Ask you, me, I, but I have no interest. The thing is, if you love history. If you love culture, if you, uh, what is art? Art is artist's vision and like his comment, commentary on contemporary times, the times on, not contemporary, but any time, like a renaissance artist painted about their time.

It's like if you are a literature, like if you're a writer, you will write about Contempt, our times, right? Same way a painting is a depiction of that, that, those times, whether it's the costume, whether it's the like, uh, you know, the Bengal famine. So there are artists who are actually commenting through paintings.

Sure. So that's what it is. Like Hussain Saab's work is, is a commentary on different cultures and, and horses. Of course, horses, which he was inspired, it was from the Chinese calligraphy painting. So there's a whole history behind it, you know. I've been called a lot of things, Shalini, [00:26:00] but fashionable is not You're Indian chic right now.

But okay, I'm Indian chic. Because your kurta is more crisp than mine. But you're just, you're just, you're just compensating for having called me politician first. But I'm not. But okay, now, I don't know, what is your pursuit in life, the higher purpose? Because you mentioned it in the show as well that, and I'll come to that bit where you, the only time where you got really pissed off in the show and I was very surprised because otherwise your reactions were cool as a cucumber, you know, Aandhi aaye, tufan aaye, sar kate mundi ude.

You know, Shalini doesn't lose her temper. aare the. There was a storm. But you were chill. But on a completely unexpected thing, you weren't sure, but I'll come to that later. But at that point you said you have a higher purpose in life. What is your pursuit? So, uh, we all live for ourselves, right? We all live for ourselves, no?

For our families, for our dreams, [00:27:00] for our, uh, you know, for our, whatever you want to do. Like, you know, I want to do this for myself, or I want to do this for my father, or I want to, like, you Impress my father. I want to impress my wife or for my children. I'm living for my children. And your, how much steam can you take out of that?

Right? How much steam can you actually take out? But when you say, I'm, I want to live for a higher purpose, which is like when I want to do things for others and see beyond my I sort of put my own needs and my own self and my own safety in God's hand. And I said, you know, I want to do these things and I want to do like, I want to do many things.

Just take care of me because everything I'm doing, I'm almost doing for others. My entire fee that I charge for any modeling or acting project goes to UNICEF. And my entire work is just, um, at the foundation, we make no money from, from MASH. So everything is just, I'm [00:28:00] doing for others, whether it's for the art community or it's for the philanthropy works, I say, but I also need strength.

So I said, I need strength in my body. And my I need mental strength to be carrying out the things that I need to do and I will make my higher purpose just doing these things. If you just give me mental clarity and strength of the body, it was like a it's like a prayer. And that's how I believe. I believe that.

to be able to do, uh, I mean, you have to live more than just what you want to do for your Sure. I mean, not being judgy or anything, but, you know, I have to ask that, you know, philanthropy is something that I, I get, you know, if you have, you know, one roti to give half to someone requires sacrifice. If you have a gazillion to give, you know, It's easier to give, I agree with you.

So, so I'm just saying, It's that much more easier. Yeah, that's fine. Which is why I think wealthy people do more philanthropy than others. Of course. So, which is fantastic. But [00:29:00] if I'm just going with the image and no judgment here, but I'm just saying that, you know, when you said that you bathe in milk, I was, uh, When did I say that?

On the show, right? No, they were saying something and I just said yes to anything. I said, I wasn't. Okay, okay, got it. That's not true. I just said, Like, I just said yes because I don't want to be sitting and explaining myself, like, unnecessarily. But you don't, actually. Okay. We'll be like, yeah. Because I was wondering that then there should be two, three cows around here, unless you're cutting like ten amul packets.

No, but you can't have cows, na, because maweshis are not allowed in this area. You should know that. Did you? I didn't actually. Yeah. Did you actually actually? Contemplate doing that ever? Contemplate nahi, because the thing is that obviously I read the rules of the city. Naveshis are no longer allowed in.

Now you can't keep cow, gai, bakri, ghoda. Right. So. That's the rule. So, okay. So, because I was a little. Surprised for a variety [00:30:00] of reasons. One is that I was like, you know, a milk product on you. It must be a little chip chip. Secondly, I exactly I don't want I do there's no point in explaining. Uh, so you just said yes.

I just said like yeah, what are all the people thinking we're watching the show? I don't know what they're thinking. They'll anyway think something, na? Okay, so coming back to the show, the moment that I was talking about where Andhi aaye, tufaan aaye, sar kate mundi ode, Shalini doesn't lose her cool, she's just, you know, cool as a cucumber.

But the one time where, about lunch or in store something, which I thought was, I was very surprised, but You said you don't want your life being trivialized. Can you elaborate what, what did you really mean by that? So actually like what you, there's also a lot of things that happen behind the scenes. Okay.

Uh, you know, everything is not put on camera. So it wasn't just that thing. It was a buildup. It was a buildup. Yeah. I see. Okay. It was a very long buildup actually. [00:31:00] Long buildup. Yeah. So tell us what happened that we didn't get to see on the show. Were they, they were meaner to you than what we saw? No, no, nothing like that.

They were very nice. But like, yeah, everybody goes to their own. I thought everyone's picked on, but you were picked on more than others. But I'm used to being picked on my entire life. Is that right? Why? Yeah, because I think sometimes somewhere people think, Oh, she's too pretty or something or whatever.

Who picks on you? Thank you. Who picks on you? Since, well, since you're a kid, you know, some people really like you because you're pretty. Some people don't like you because you're too pretty. So what do they do? Yeah, they just like make comments which are like, you know, which are just, they think they are like, but I have, I have a thick skin, so I'm used to it.

And it's not because of the milk. Okay, so coming to that, uh, what, when you said you don't like your life being trivialized, isn't that what shows like this can do? Make a big thing out of something that is trivial and at the [00:32:00] same time, trivialize something that is profound or important to you because whatever gets eyeballs is what, what is priority, right?

Uh, the, or the makers make things which Uh, the audience consumes. So either you educate your audience, or yeah, but I think the show has been very aspirational. People have really liked the ideas of, idea of being free, and get, like I get videos from people who are in Goa, in Maldives, in, you know Phuket, running onto the beach.

So I think somewhere people, I think, uh, they have sort of got inspired by the free spiritedness. Yeah. And I think it's what anybody takes. And I mean, we are doing a project where it's going to be viewed by so many people. As I said, if you're making an art film, then it's different. Yeah. But as a pop culture phenomenon, I mean, you understand art way more than I do, but I'm just guessing what, [00:33:00] what technology allowed let's say in the 16, 17, 18 hundreds was Yeah.

You know, then, um, celluloid alloy allowed different things, you know, clay allowed different things. Now, you know, cameras and the always accessible phone allows different things. So I'm guessing 200, 300, 400, 500 years from now, this will be considered art, not just art films, but just popular culture is also art.

Like Andy Warhol was also an artist. But he was also a pop culture artist. But, but, uh, don't you think in that sense, even a show like this will be a statement or a commentary of our times for many generations? Of course, it's a statement. What is it? Does it? Do you think it can be? trivializes, you know, reality shows in general, not your show, but generally.

I think, uh, it's how the audiences perceive it. If you look at, uh, Bhavna, [00:34:00] Neelam, they've had like amazing lives and they are amazing parents and, you know, they are loved by their families. So if how the audiences wants to see it, it's up to them. Like Neelam at the age of 18 has been acting. I think she has delivered more hits than, So people should see like that, like, I think Bhavna is such an amazing human being and a mother and all these women, not just like this show, they have so much more beyond that.

So it's for people to find substance and write about it. It's for people to see value in what Kalyani is doing. She's a single mother. Seema as, as like, you know, she has a creative and a fun side. So. People have to take value what they can take value, like when I go somewhere to a city, I can choose to see the good or the ugly or the amazing, that's my choice, right?

So I think the audience also somewhere has to, uh, [00:35:00] be able to gauge for themselves that what is it they're looking for. But all the things that you said, I'm getting from you about Neelam and her spectacular. I don't get that from the show. I'm saying, as a concept, reality shows, what do you think they do?

I think that, like, I think nobody can deny that Neelam was one of the most successful actresses for the really long time. Like, I mean, she's given some of the best hits. So, I don't know what I can say. They're not finding substance in that, then. No, no, I'm not, they are clearly, people are watching. I'm just saying.

As an art connoisseur, what do you think reality shows, and not just your show, let's forget Neelam and the rest, but like, as a genre, reality shows, I think Urfi's show, sorry, Urfi's show, uh, Urfi's show. Urfi Javed's show. Follow Karlo Yaar. And, uh, I think I saw, I saw it. And, uh, I [00:36:00] am, I, I know her as a person.

I've met her. Her journey is just amazing. Because she says somewhere, I'm from the road and she, I think that woman probably has inspired so many people and I think there's somewhere, of course, there's the good and there's the bad and there's the not so good and there's something, which is, but I think it's what you, It's what you make of it.

You know, David Beckham is doing it. He has a thing. The Kardashians have done 13, 14. Trump has become the president thanks to his reality shows. So, I mean, Trump was a successful businessman before as well. Yeah, but he became a household name because of The Apprentice. I mean, that's what catapulted him, which was I think 12 or 13 seasons of a reality show.

Wow, amazing. So there's, I mean, there's something for everybody. Do you watch Bigg Boss? I do. I watch very limited television. What do you watch? Very. What is your Very limited, I have you heard of Big Bus though? Of course I've heard. Would you do a big bus? I, I've, I went to [00:37:00] the big bus set in Australia many years in 2001.

Would you do that show? It was in one of the theme parks and uh, we went outside. We saw it and there was some, it's all of, it's, I think, one of the most successful franchises all over. Would you do a show like that? I have no, I don't know. I have not seen the show actually. So what do you watch? What are your favourite shows?

I love watching historical documentaries. Uh, I saw Versailles. I've seen Versailles. I've seen, uh, Napoleon I saw recently on Netflix. Uh, I saw my own show. Yeah. Which will go down in history as a historic show. And, sorry? Which will go down in history as a historic show. Really? By the way, that's a fantastic, do you listen to podcasts?

Yeah. No, but you can suggest some good ones to me. There's the rest is history. I think it is one of the most brilliant podcasts out there. Really? I'd say nothing comes close. And it's two really funny guys. They're both British journalists. I think one's a writer, one's a journalist. Please send me this. I would love to [00:38:00] watch it.

I'll send you the link. It's just audio. Oh, it's audio. But, so you can, while exercising, I saw you exercise in a cryogenic room, you have a cryogenic room in this house? Yeah, so, no, that was outside, we didn't, uh, yeah. But what is a cryogenic room? Really wanna know? Yeah. So, basically, if you, uh, it's, it helps in sports injuries.

And especially like, you know, if you work out a lot, it actually, um, Minus five and all. Heals them. I've forgotten what temperature we were doing at. And, uh, yeah, it's good for the bones and for the joints. Yeah. Quick recovery. Also burns like calories to 300 calories it burns. But it's more for like the recovery.

So a lot of sports people are doing it because it's like, uh, it really has a good effect on the joints. I see. So, uh, so, okay. You like historical shows, documentary. Films, what are the films you like? Films, uh, only if I hear very good things about a film, like exceptionally good. Tell me a film you've loved in the past 2 3 years that you've watched.

[00:39:00] Past 2 3 years, I think I loved Jawan and Pathan were amazing. Me too. I really enjoyed it. They were my top 3. I love both. I watched both 3 4 times in the cinema. I'm a Shah Rukh fan. Yeah, of course, Shah Rukh, Shah Rukh, of course, of course. But Deepika was amazing. Like, I just loved her. She's amazing. So, uh, other than that, any, um, you know, historical films that you really liked?

You know, as far as Just a MI mean, of course, these really old films. I love MI love the old New Mm. Uh, I love, I love Gone With the Wind. Uh, life is beautiful, beautiful, very beautiful. And I, I love, I love films which are set in, uh, world War I, that World War I, that 1940s period is, I don't know, I just love film Set International and Indian both.

So I love that. And I love like. Like, of course, Saavariya, is one of my favourite films from Sanjay Leela Bansali. That was the one, uh, which introduced, uh, [00:40:00] Ranbir and, uh, Sonam. I personally don't like Bansali films at all. I think they're just terrible. But, anyway, to each their own. I mean, I just think that I just like it because, like, it's a paint, it's like, frame to frame, it's a painting.

So, I think he would be a fantastic ad filmmaker because the detailing, like, Because it's like, painting is frame to frame. Yeah, exactly. It's complete. Even that OTT show, uh, set in Lahore, which I couldn't watch more than half an episode to be honest, but just the detailing of, you know, uh, uh, uh, anybody's hand also moves in the same way as the Diyas going this way.

I think to make a movie, you need a story more than a pretty frame. I don't know what that means. I think Savaria was beautiful. I think, um, Do you watch news? Not, never. Stop taking notes. Why do you say it with such certainty? And nobody's allowed to switch it on when I'm there or I'm around because it's like you, like, it's like people are just throwing things at you.

They're so loud. [00:41:00] That tone makes me stressed. Because they're just saying it, saying it, and they say it ten times. And then after that, So I realized, uh, like, this scam will come out, they'll, like, give all the details, then they'll prove it wrong, then they'll prove it right, then it'll be in the papers, and then after two years of listening to it, it will disappear.

So there's no point. So there is no point, like, I just, if I have to read news, I go on an app. May I recommend News Laundry? You should try that. Yes. No shouting. Please send me. I'll send you one. I just like, the thing is that And we don't even take ads. That's the beauty. This drama, it's like I'm having palpitations just thinking about the news anchor's tones.

It's just It stresses me out. Me too, yeah. It's like, I want to know news, like in the olden days, didi, didi news, you're reading it properly, you're reporting on something. Not just fighting. Let us analyze, or get people who are, [00:42:00] who are actually known to analyze, not just anybody's opinion, anyone from the road, aap kya samajhte hain, yeh hua hai.

If I have to ask anybody.

Yeah, absolutely correct. And I would just like to take this opportunity to tell you that learn from Shalini Legacy Media is just high bp. You should watch news Laundry. No yelling, no shouting, pay to keep news free, because when the public pays, the public is served. See, we don't take ads. That's the beauty of our app.

But just saying that, you know, these days in news, one person's opinion on anything, foreign policy, same guy, monetary policy, same guy. But are you, are you qualified to speak about foreign policy? And Suhail Singh is qualified for everything, by the way, he's on every show. Yes, but he, I really admire Suhail Singh.

Yeah, of course. I'm, Yeah, he's amazing. But he's commenting on everything [00:43:00] and anything. But he is very, very knowledgeable and he's opinionated and he's not scared to share his opinions. I think he is. He only shares opinions that are pro current government. He never shares opinions against current government.

That I know. I'm just saying. I've seen. Everyone does that. But anyway, we won't get into news because it's stress inducing. It's, we are here to do. The entertainment podcast of News Laundry. So, um, we were talking about reality shows. Sir is very entertaining, right? Who is? You guys are laughing behind the camera.

I, I, I, entertainment is my middle name. It's not actually. It's, boredom is my middle name. But, um, we were talking about, you know, success, you said what you think of reality shows, etc. But, uh, as a commentary of the times we live in. But, do you think. Reality show is all about either the spectacular, like, you know, just your appearance on, I would have loved to watch the show on actually big screen because [00:44:00] when you come with that, you know, when I think that I don't know whether it's, I don't know the difference.

But, uh, basically it's a shiny object. It could be a diamond. It could be crystal with the cross on your neck sitting completely symmetrical, you know, frame. Now either it has to be spectacular or it has to be ridiculous, which Big Boss does where, you know, people are throwing things, no one is throwing things that, I mean, I watched the episode that no one threw anything at anybody.

There was an accidental champagne, but that was an accident. There was no, that is what you need to attract an audience. Is, is that what you'd say reality shows are about, either the spectacular or the ridiculous? And why do you say you're both? Has someone said that? No, I just like, I like, I like to get the, I'm like.

You're pre empting. No, I'm just like, yeah, sure. No, I, I, I'm just saying what, don't you think that's what reality shows us? Spectacular. The thing is, I, I love beautiful things. Okay. There's no doubt about it. And for me, it's not just [00:45:00] the being in front of the camera. So I would actually like, uh, you know, do the setups and plan everything.

So for me, I enjoy doing like that, you know, setting up things like you have here. And I can't wait to So for me, it's also like a fun, costume changes, like a costume changes. This is all part of the fun. Okay. Then honestly, how much of it is reality? Because do you actually change a costume? You see, we won't change right now.

Really? Like I was, yeah. And something else before. So. Okay. No, I didn't see you. So you quickly went and changed. I mean, I saw that there were eight or nine people here. Like I have interviewed politicians, but I've never seen an entourage as big as yours. Because everybody's tired after Diwali. So what are all these people said responsibility and duty.

They, they're on their phone. They're on Instagram. On their own. Instagram? Yeah. But they possibility yours around? Yeah, they just, they're with me, so Yeah. That's your, they're like my family, whatever. Like Yeah. We are like, hang together. We travel together. Really? So you never have solo trips? No. Really? Why not?[00:46:00]

I'm used to, I mean, they're used to it. But they are, I'm talking about you. Solo trips, I don't know what I'll do at a solo trip. I'll be like, uh, yeah, I don't do solo trips. Mostly with my team. Okay. Because there is one news anchor, sorry to come to you again. His name is Sudhir Chaudhary on Zee. He is often saying, taking a lonely walk by myself, solitary walk in a park and someone's clicking a photo.

So I'm like, who's clicking the picture if you're alone? But I don't think they think about that when they post it. No, when you are, so the thing is that, um, you don't have to be, I could be in a party and I could be totally on my own. You know what I'm saying? Does that happen often? Yeah, because, uh, yeah, I'm like, um, I could be at a big party, but then I'm just on my own, right?

You can be like in your own thoughts whenever you want. You don't have to be not be surrounded with people or be surrounded with people. It's just, uh, uh, they help me with, uh, you know, when I'm shooting, when, when we are doing sightseeing. So [00:47:00] there's so much and I enjoy with them. They enjoy with me. So I'm, I see.

So, but sorry, I digressed. How much of it is actually real? You said I'll go and change and come back, but like in the middle of, uh, There's some guests have come to your house in the middle of an evening. You go change and comes. I mean, I have done that. And they've been pretty. I've done that because I wanted to be more comfortable or you know, like, whatever.

I wanted to be more comfortable or I was just tired because many times when I actually set up. For the party, I've been there like I've been first I get dressed. And if if my guests are arriving at seven o'clock, then I would already be dressed by like 530 and doing the final rounds of the flowers or the food or checking every on everything or like I also do the flowers myself or sometimes the desserts, I would already be in the outfit, which I have to be okay.

And then by the evening, then like, And then everybody's like, everybody's like, enjoying and then I just slip out, you know. And change and come back. Yeah, in five minutes. I thought it only happens in [00:48:00] Hindi films. But it actually happens in real life. It does. And now it's become a thing. I have people, I have friends.

Who do the same thing? Have you set a trend? It's like, somebody, my friend is like, you know, there were like five girls and they went inside and they said, you know, I need a change of energy, so I changed my outfit and they came out in another outfit. So have you set this trend? I don't know. Yeah, not really.

I'm sure people have been doing it before. So can we just say that if you change in the middle of a party saying, I'm doing a Shalini, that's what you should say? That's what they're saying. Okay. You said you like doing things back to back. You know, take us through your routine. What, what, what is a day in the life of Shalini?

Because I didn't get that in the show. Because show, everything was, It's a production. Ki bhai, lunch hai toh ek, it's a production, ab Mauritius jaana hai, it's a production. But in regular life, what is Shalini doing from the time she wakes up? So I wake up in the morning and I have my, uh, the morning, my breakfast.

And then after All raw? Yeah, it's [00:49:00] raw. And then I also have ghee and like You have a shot of ghee, right? You have a shot of ghee, then goat, uh, goat curd. Uh, then I do my meetings for the Art Foundation for MASH. I do my meetings, which are about like an hour or so, a little bit more. Uh, catch up on all the emails, reply to all the emails.

Mostly I do my communications at night because I find that much easier because I'm at home. Peace. I can talk to people at length, but in the day it's more like, uh, you know, uh, wrapping up, like actually giving, delegating to my team so they can carry forward whatever has happened at night. And then after that I have, I do my, I know before, uh, before I do my meeting, I do, I meditate.

A little bit in the morning. What is meditating like? So I hear, listen to sometimes, um, just music and I meditate like, meditate. Eyes closed and blank mind? Uh, it's not blank mind, you're focusing on something, but something sometimes it [00:50:00] disappears and sometimes it comes back. How long do you sit for? Uh, maybe 10, 15, 20 minutes, depends how much, uh, like, like totally depends if I'm not like in a hurry or stressed.

And sometimes if I'm in the zone, then I stay longer. But sometimes if I'm not able to concentrate, then I let go and I come out. I mean, I tried meditating once I got dizzy, so I stopped, like clearly it's not for me. But when you said if you're stressed, you don't meditate, isn't the idea of meditation that you should?

If I'm stressed. Um, I mean, if I am stressed, I'm not like, if I'm stressed, no, I'm not, I said it wrong. If I want to do something which is very important that day, then you'll skip, then I skip it or make it shorter. Then I don't like sort of try to, because also the mind is wanting to finish the hundred other things that are required that day.

But over the years I've built up. my system so strong with meditation and exercise that I can like, like how you can survive without say, like, so I've [00:51:00] made my mental strength stronger to be able to not do it one day, two days, and then go back to it. So what stresses you out? Uh, what stresses me out? Uh, people who are not punctual, uh, people who are not punctual.

Me too. Yeah. Same page on that. And, uh, sorry if I walked in late. No, no, I wasn't late. Uh, no. People who are not punctu people. Them what? That's the first thing I'd say. Yeah. People who don't respect other people's time. Okay. You know, uh, that, you know, film crews are notorious for that. No. During the filming, everyone, everything was on time.

Yeah, so, uh, yeah, I used to, like, arrive before time, initially. Then, uh, then after that, I said, you know what, I'm going to be on time. Because no point arriving before time, you know. Because no one else was ready. Yeah, initially. But now I am the last one on the set. You have learnt the ways of Bollywood has changed you, Shalini.

You have become a late person. But then we have our own thing, we do our behind the scenes and all which are happening with my own team. We have so much more fun, we are cracking jokes. [00:52:00] So like, you know. You said you have more fun, but there are no cameras rolling then. No, we have our own like camera team.

So which we are doing our own thing. And we are just like, uh, and having fun and, yeah, basically that. And another thing I don't like is like, uh, people are not loyal. You Okay. Yeah. Have you had a lot of people? No, not, not, not by loyal. I mean, like, trust. Also trust is very important. Have you had your trust broken in life often?

No, I don't trust anyone. Okay. That's, that's, that's how the mob operates. Trust no one. Trust no one. Someone is like telling me that they, it's like, uh, like someone told me that they trust me, trust me, trust me, trust me. I said, you know, please don't take it personally. I don't trust anyone. Why? I trust myself because I don't want to put people on that thing and then, huh, if they deliver, I'll be like, wow.

That can only happen if you have your trust broken. If, if they deliver, I'm like, wow, this is amazing. I'm saying one only becomes that cynical if one has had that trust broken. I'm very cynical. Why are you so [00:53:00] cynical? What, what, who has broken I'm, one, I'm very trusting when it comes to my team and my, I'm just like totally for them.

But like, Even if I trust you, trust you, like, I'll always have a plan A, I'll have a plan A, a plan B, a plan C, a plan D, a plan E, a plan F. That's fantastic, but why? I'm saying why is it like that? Yeah, because. That is only because. You have trust broken, of course. And why, who, when? Over the years, so many people.

Such as? You know, growing up friends. Relationships work wise, you know, okay's, and then it's not that, that I'm not close to those people anymore, but they might see it as breaking us trust, like if they say something or something, which is been said, but it was not their intention to break the trust. But now I, I keep to myself, I don't share, I don't like, so that means you don't have any.

Do you have a soulmate, any friend who you can have a heart to heart with? Do you have a soulmate? Oh, I have, of course. Oh, wow, wow. Yeah, we, I have. I'm very, I have been very lucky with friends. My biggest [00:54:00] investment in life is friends. So, I've come to this thing that, uh, my friends share everything with me, I share very less with them.

It's the best policy. So, you know. So, no, but, but. Because also the problem is like, you know, you, if you have a problem in your life, something is happening, you will tell someone, the problem will go away. Right. Right. But that person will still remind you of that thing that I hate. Because you know, they'll keep wanting to bring that up.

Like, you know, you say something, suppose I have a problem with a friend or if I have had some issues with anything, right? Some work wise or I had some illness and everything will be fine with time. But the friends, Okay, how is he? How is he? So, but like, you know what I'm saying? That, that, what I don't like, because what's in the past is in the past.

It's like water under the bridge. It's clear that you have had your trust broken. You don't want to tell us why, which is fine. But, you know, on a related point, on that show, uh, you know, two of your [00:55:00] fellow, uh, stars in the show were having this heart to heart, the Bombay, uh, party, uh, About, oh, what's wrong with that?

No, I, I just find it hard to believe that someone who's actually a good friend, and if you have some issues with them. You would resolve it with cameras rolling, like who does that? So how much of it is real reality and how much is performative? Like, would you try to resolve something that really matters in your life with like three cameras there?

Like you don't even want to tell me who broke your trust. There'll be so many, that'll be a very long list. You'll need like five shows. I have time. So, uh, the, uh, it's a completely non crypto. Scripted show because we are not actors. I can't even if you ask me the same question Why don't you try asking me the same question?

I would not be able to reply to you. No, I understand, but it's not authentic, right? Yeah, do you think it's reasonable and rational to expect two people? I think that is the beauty of reality television that it's [00:56:00] happening there and then, it's very organic and there's no, I don't have a script yaar, there's no script But is it authentic?

Not having a script is spontaneous but not authentic But what did you feel? When you saw it, what did you feel? Did you feel it was, uh, Did you feel it was written? Did you feel that? I didn't feel that the lines, the interaction was written, but I just found it uh, you know, when two friends are talking Everybody's, uh, your perception is different.

Like some people like, yeah, like, you know, yours is different. Everybody will think differently. Like the women will say, okay, we also have similar issues and we also discuss this. I really can't comment on So it's real. It's real. It's totally, uh, non scripted. But not authentic? Of course authentic also because they are also not actresses, they are also just speaking their mind.

So all the stuff you say, okay, is reality or authentic, depending on how you want to define it. What is Karan [00:57:00] Johar doing on this show? Is he everyone's shrink that oh, you know, you are like this and you are like this and he's giving everybody gone about the emotional state of being while also being unreasonably curious for an adult into other people's sex lives.

I don't understand. What is that about? Like what? What value does it add to the show? Uh, I, I think, uh, I think Karan has a very fun way of looking at things and I think he's also the link between all of us, you know, in ways as, as friends, like, you know, I've met, uh, some of the girls through him as well at his, uh, events or dinners.

So I think he's sort of a link between all of us. And also the fact that I think he and Maheep and the Bombay Girls are very, very close. Like I've invited my friends on the show as well. You know, so like I had Ruchika and Ramona and you know, one or two other people. So I think that way he knows all of us.

So I think for him to be involved is rather nice. I really enjoyed [00:58:00] his part with me. I see. And Saif is the intellectual, is it? Cause he did that whole book thing where, uh, he asked you about books, et cetera, right? The 40 rules of love. Where he asked you some question. You got upset then also. You got a little pissed off with the question.

No, not at all. I did, I did answer the question. I did answer the He asked what is one rule and I did, I think, answer it. What is one rule? What is this book, first of all? Is it like It's, uh, Elif Shafak, Forty Rules of Love. And, uh I mean, is it just a metaphor for life or it's about love, love, love? No, so it's written by a Turkish author.

Okay. And, uh, basically she's talking about Rumi's life with, uh, Shams, and teachings from that, you know. So there are 40 teachings, and he asked me one of them, and I blanked out at that moment, but, yeah. Is, is, was Saif the intellectual in the show, on the show? I don't know, was that, uh, I think we went to, I think it was Bhavna's idea to get him on, so.

Which is very well read, is it? Of course, he's very well read. [00:59:00] Well, his favorite author is Anne Rand. Is it? Which I think he said in one of the Is it on the show? Not on the show, on another reel, which I Okay. It's difficult to keep track of everybody's favorite. I think once you're like past the teens, Ayn Rand can't be your favorite author.

Really? Yeah. I don't know. A 15, 17 year old can say that, but a 50 year old person saying Ayn Rand is That you should do another interview with, Saif. I know I should. Now, this is the mystery. This is a whole investigative journalistic team could not crack. Shobha Day's post that caused all that palava.

Where is that post? Is, uh, maybe, I don't know, is it still there? It's an old post. We tried to find it, we couldn't find it. Was the post there or has it been made up for the show? Uh, yeah, the post was there. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so clearly our investigative reporters have not been able to investigate enough.

So we need to go back, we need to go really back. So that means it was very, very long ago. Yeah. I see. In case I'm going on and on, just tell me, I'll wind up in five minutes, because I have so many, [01:00:00] so many questions. Are we on time? We have time. We have ten minutes. Because, you know, you'd be surprised to know that Cut kutke bahut chota ho jata hai.

Nahi, nahi. Hamari unedited hota hai. Acha, okay. Yes, yes. No, no, not that. But we will, we will not cut. Like this will be the, okay, like that just wear, I'm drinking water or something. Maybe may cut, but , that is the beauty of news laundry, you know, , add free, unedited, launder. Everything. Lau everything. But new tagline, you'll get, we launder everything.

Actually, a tagline is sub. Oh, really? Yeah. But I am the bride of milk. How will you insult me? Too good. Literally and metaphorically. According to the show. According to the grapevine. Good one, no? So, clearly proves that her lines weren't written. [01:01:00] She comes up with them there and then, but, uh, do you know, a lot of people are rooting for you on that show, including me.

I'm not a, I mean, I'll be honest. I'm not a fan of reality television, but I was told you have to watch this and you have to interview Shalini. And I will tell you, everybody, everybody, people who know you, people who don't know you. And I have interviewed a lot of people in my life. I, you know, joined NewsTrek when I was 20 years old.

I'm 50 now, 30 years. Wow. I have not got so many suggestions about what you should ask more than you. And I have interviewed, you know, politicians, writers, journalists, authors, filmmakers, actors, but everybody had a question for Shalini. No one. I've interviewed chief ministers, cabinet ministers. No one gives a shit.

I'm so embarrassed now. Okay, ask her and come back. No one gave crap sass. I'm really embarrassed now. But Shalini, what is it? Why is everyone rooting for you? I've barely done every anything. I've barely, [01:02:00] like, done anything in my life. But what is it? Why is everyone rooting for you on that show? I don't know.

You tell me. I'm pleasantly surprised as well. I can tell you but then I'll be considered rude. But the thing is that I'm loving that everybody is sending so much love and even our DMs are all questions and I'm sending Who's our DMs? The Royal R or R meaning like my DMs. So do you already refer to yourself as our our because I'm sitting and then sometimes I'm dictating the messages Like literally it's like i'm sitting there i'm sending voice audio And then that voice audio is being sent everybody's asking different questions and then they are reading out questions to me And i'm like type they're like typing it out, you know, because I can't always be typing.

So sure So by our, you mean the team? Yeah, all, yeah. Okay, thank God. No, but I can tell you, but it won't be considered rude to you, but I can tell you why everybody's rooting for you. I mean, I watched the show and even I was rooting for you. Thank you. I just think everybody on that show comes across [01:03:00] as really petty and mean.

Sorry, they're friends of yours. And you know, you asked, so I'm just answering. Because, sach bolna hamari aadat hai. News laundry ki aadat hai. But, uh, but isn't that what the show is about? Okay. Be mean to each other and make good, good reality television out of that. But there was the, the apart season 2, uh, yeah.

I have not seen any season of this show. This is the only But I think, uh, I don't know, like, I don't know what happened, basically. Like, I honestly don't know what happened. It's like I was ready for the fame, but I was not ready for the love. Now I'm having the love and I'm asking my therapist that, you know, what happens when the, but The love dries out like will I feel different when the audiences are not sending me these thousands of messages And you know, so I'm actually not thinking that's why you should have a friend who you trust because then I don't get too much Adulation therapist that also maybe That you know Like, I'm not thinking [01:04:00] like, you know, if I'm famous, I'm just asking her, like, you know, what if like after like, you know, the, the love and the messages, like what happens?

How does one feel? Because I want to be like, what you're saying, I've already moved away. I'm already in a zone where I'm preparing that, you know, like the messages will become less and the love and people be more judgmental or not. So I'm just like, I'm preparing myself for that. So whatever anybody's saying or thinking, I've already The train has, Elvis has left the building.

You see. Right. Truly Elvis has, but, I'm not a trained therapist. Uh, but since I'm in a new space and we pay a lot of gyan on everything, I, I could suggest that, I think that there is a, I'll completely misquote it, so I will not even try it. There's a, there's a poem called If by Rudyard Kipling, if I'm not wrong.

Is that by Rudyard Kipling? If, just check, Google it. But that, you know, success and failure should be the same for you. You know, popularity. Like I find it. [01:05:00] Thank you for this. I find it really very annoying, actually. And if I get, A little irritated and everybody does this. It's a celebrity that you didn't, just must say.

You only seem to be looking at the love and stuff, which is phenomenal. I think that's great to keep positive. You know, on the show, your show, Karan Johar did it. I've seen chief ministers like Omar Abdullah do it. I've seen journalists do it. Some of them are friends, so I will not take their names. Really famous, big names.

Oh, we are trolled on Twitter. Oh, people are mean to us. I'm like, seriously, dude, you want? The regular person who is dealing with, you know, backbreaking problems in life to give a shit that a chief minister or an industrialist or a bloody actor or some billionaire is being trolled on Twitter and they make a production of it and they whine about it.

And I'm like, dude, trolling on Twitter is your biggest issue and you want a person who is making their ends meet give a shit about it. So I just think, so, you know, too much love or too much hate gives a [01:06:00] shit. Yeah. But see, for me, it's the, uh, I'm experiencing this for the first time, so I need to prepare myself that will I feel differently?

I'm just protecting my own heart, you know. Yeah, but then you must not get addicted to this because then the tendency is you have to do something more and more outrageous to get more and more attention. No, no, no, that's what it is. No, I, I am who I am. I'm not just going to do something to get something right.

I'm going to do what I feel like doing. But I also want to be, I've been at, I've worked for things which I've had no acknowledgement or no, I've still worked because that is just doing. Beautiful. Beautiful. This is the most beautiful thing I've heard in the last one week. But Krishanji said it, I didn't. I agree with you.

So, my phal, my karma, my, my happiness is in doing the karma. I am thinking that I am blessed that if I can work, like how many people have this opportunity, how many people are able to think beyond, [01:07:00] how many able People are able to actually go beyond. So people have a Subodh Gupta. Is that a Subodh Gupta in their, in their garden?

Yeah. It is a Subodh Gupta. So for me, it's like, I'm just thinking, I don't want to like, I'm just thinking, I'm just grateful for what I'm doing. And the love has come, which is a bonus. As long as you can remain like that. So, uh, usually my therapy lessons are free. But I have worked for zero acknowledgement and for zero fame also.

And I have done it. But you still got it. More passion. But you still got it? I still got it. Maybe it was the culmination of everything I did. That what you pursue you will not get. And when you don't pursue you get. I have a song for this. Sing. Justju jissi ki si usko toh na paya humne Justju jissi ki si usko toh na paya humne Is bahane se magar dekh li, duniya humne, [01:08:00] justju jis ki thi.

Ek line aap bol gayi? Pyaar ka lamba safar tay kiya tanha. Wo doosre mein hai. Acha, doosre mein hai. Pura gaane ke liye toh fir, Dhobi Ghat jaana padega na. You know, Dhobi Ghat was a show on News Laundry that Madhu used to anchor. Yay! Yay! And that is one of the most beautiful films, Umrao Jaan. It was just, I think Muzaffar Ali is a genius only for that.

Muzaffar Ali is an artist. Yes, exactly. And a designer. And he's painting now. Do you know? He's so multifaceted. When I was in my 30s, I started taking tabla lessons. I was very keen to play tabla. Your style is perfect for a student. Like Zakir Hussain. So the gentleman who used to come to teach me he was from Aap mere show mein aayiye.

Main gaungi, aap tabla bajayiye. Done. Theek hai, agle mein. Nadendinda. Nadendinda. Nadendinda. Tirkade, tirkade, tirkade. Amazing. See, we have a talent here. Let me just tell you. My point being You have. [01:09:00] See, everybody has it in them. What are people doing? Why are you an actor? You could be like so entertaining.

Like, like wow. You can change, you can become, do the tabla and in between, see, sneak yourself in, you see. Into what? A reality show? Reality. Like sneak yourself into the world of the larger audience and play the tabla and then Basically sneak myself into high society. And your, no, and your ideas that you have, right?

Seep them in slowly. Package it, package it in a beautiful way. dekha. Are you understanding what I'm saying? No, but let me come to my point. Because when you want your ideas to spread to other people, you have to change the way maybe you are, so that, that, those, that audience understands it. Right? Sometimes your cause is more important than everything else.

My identity. Your identity. I'm going to leave here learning so much from you. Just like you may have learnt or seem to have learnt. I will forget everything tomorrow. If you ask me again tomorrow, I will have a different philosophy. No problem, but I will remember. [01:10:00] But speaking of Muzaffar Ali, so when I used to learn the tabla, Nizami Sahib.

And he used to and I just love the sound of tabla. Yeah. So I'd start doing this and he says to build stamina You have to keep your elbows here and because you can't get yeah, so I do this and then I'd start saying He used to eat paan

See, multi talented man. Doesn't mean I'm Muzaffar Ali. No, but I'm talking about him, not you. Now you're becoming me on the show. You're already, like, you're already picking up my traits. It's about me, me, me. It's about me, me, me. What is this now? Come on. Very bad. Now you're getting influenced by me. I think I'll get some good influence from you all.

I'm also getting good influence from you. Good. Okay, now out of all the people on the show, who do you like the most? Who do you like the least? Uh, I really liked Seema and Maheep. They're like so much fun. Like in terms of fun. Maheep is a Delhi [01:11:00] girl, right? Yeah, Delhi. I know she's lived all over the world.

Okay, okay. She's traveled all over the world Mahipuya are your favorites? Because I found them fun. They're like fun, fun. Okay. In terms of like, And least favorite? And we don't have to be among the seven of you. Generally, out of all the people you met in the show. Out of all the people I met, Uh, least two I didn't like.

No one actually. Everyone was good. You are too full of love to be honest about this. No, I, I think I was terrible on the show. There must be someone. I was terrible. I was terrible on the show because I was like, you see, I'm missing out words. Sometimes my speech is not clear because I used to also stammer.

How does it matter if you're missing out words? Yeah, but come on everybody, I speak to Ben. Now we have a tableau of Delhi with pollution and smog. Don't say all this about Delhi, it's so clean, what's wrong with you? I'm really, I will walk out now. Maybe in your amazing home, but out there it's T A T A Q I.

But it's all in your mind. It's in my lungs also, [01:12:00] Shalini. No, it's in your mind. Please don't say these things, it really upsets me. I love Delhi. I love Delhi with like a capital L, I could not. In fact, I've written an article which I'll send to you. Love Delhi with a capital L? That's so funny. Why is that funny?

Yeah, okay, whatever. Okay, and a capital O and a V and an E. Yeah, better. But that's not enough to like, you can't say, Oh, I love it and then like, Trust issues coming up. People who love you will be honest about what to say. I love Delhi, I have written an article about it. My problem is that, my problem, my issue with people who say this is that if you can't fix it, don't say it, don't highlight it.

You are a citizen of the city, if it bothers you so much, if you want to speak about it, either do something or just don't complain. I hate complaining. Don't [01:13:00] complain. Noted. Point noted. Everybody who is saying, do something or don't complain. You have made a choice, you are not doing anything about it, so don't complain at least.

Good point. It's your city, if you are like, not doing anything, then at least don't complain. I'm doing something though. Yeah, but you need to do more. But no one acknowledges all the stuff that I do. But then take ads. I'm poor, I'm useless. Then take ads. I want Hamdar Tonic Sinkara. You remember this ad?

Which one? Sinkara ad from the 1890s. I remember this, uh, Gaushink Powder Nirma is what I can think right now. Gaushink Powder Nirma. Yeah. Okay, Gauri and you are very good friends, so she must be your favorite person on the show. Hmm. Isn't it? Yeah. Um. Yeah, she, she loved the show. She saw, saw it and she said, uh, she really enjoyed it.

Okay. And, um, but you're not going to tell me who was your least favorite person. I said, no, I am. I was like, look at my eye shadow. [01:14:00] Look at my hair. Look at this. What is going on? What am I doing? There's no other reason you would. Dislike someone other than their eyeshadow not being in place or their hair not being in place.

There must be some more substantial reason. I don't have space for, um, like I said. It's not good for your skin. Also like, I mean, I'm looking at things like I'm looking at the weather outside right now. I'm just like, I want to just surround myself with happy, good things, happy thoughts, details. Is that possible?

Can you cut off what is bad about the world? You've taken me out of the art world. You've taken out. me out of the art world and put me somewhere. I'm still, I'm still, I've still surrounded, I still live in that world. Like if you go to an artist and you talk to them, they have no idea what day it is sometimes.

Artists are usually very angst ridden. Their art is a spilling over of their angst, their darlings. I have not seen a happy artist. Okay. Yeah. That, that is one of the reasons I didn't become an artist because nahi hai? Nahi. Kyonki nahi, [01:15:00] dukh, dukh nikalna padta hai. What they do is, what artists do is that you could not.

No, I could. I was, no, no.

You know what artists do?

So mentally also like 2000 5, 6, 7 women a painting. And I had a show in, uh, India Habitat Center also. And, uh, but, uh, I was very much unrested. I mean, I was very much, uh, I mean, I was having a hard time living a normal life. Normal duties. Kana, normal, socialized kana. So angst was taking its to in other ways.

I taken over for those two and a half years, I had like a show at uh, habitat, which was very successful. I donated the [01:16:00] entire funds to, um. The flood relief flood that had happened at that time around that time in JNK and to the Prime Minister's fund I donated the entire proceeds had gone. So jo wo artist hain toh wo mere se nahi ho raha tha.

You move on. My art if I was creating art, it was either just a beautiful picture Which I could no longer relate to or the art that I was creating was too much It's too painful for me to keep creating. So then my creativity now comes out in terms of fashion, decorating the house, doing the flowers, doing fun things, putting clips on my hair.

So it's all just that. And you prefer that? But because the thing is that I also, see, I'm not a trained artist, so professionally, how much further could I have taken it? Um, you know, just have my own show at Panipat Singha. But you're not a trained host, you're not a trained, you know, actor, but you still are a super successful show.

Yeah, but the thing is that I respect the art community so much that all, most of the art, all of the art, most of the artists have studied art, they have spent their entire lives. And for me, someone who's just [01:17:00] saying, I'm an artist, it just didn't feel right to, for me to be in that bracket. Kishore Kumar wasn't a trained singer.

I don't know, was Van Gogh a trained artist? Was Picasso? I think he was. I don't know. I don't know about all these people. Yeah, but they, they've also like a showman, like dedicate his entire time to, uh, like he was also an actor, but his entire passion was like singing and comedy and his voice. And so there was a time I thought I could do it, but then emotionally, and also I felt it was just, you know, I was letting go of my health.

I was not sleeping. I used to wake up in the middle of the night. And if there were like these images in my head, I would start translating it on the, on the canvas. And you obviously it's, it's like, it was like, like I was, my studio had like, I'd put like a bed in my studio because I used to get up in the middle of the night and start painting because I couldn't wait till the morning.

Paintings. Can I see them? Yeah, they were, we sold most of them. We have a few of them. And, uh, and the thing is [01:18:00] that no longer, no, I sold everything because it was for a charity. So we, I couldn't say no to anybody. I did keep a few ones which were not so good. But is it still painful when you see those, when you revisit those?

No, it's, I don't think actually that incident is completely gone because you brought it up. And the point I was trying to make is that I'm an artist. You take out an artist from the art world or the journey and put it in any field. And we will surround ourselves. that we can survive. It's like you take out a fish from the sea.

It will still live in the bowl. I still need what's around me. I'm insulated. I'm like fully insulated myself with this. What my life was in as an artist. So are you in a fishbowl right now in the ocean right now? I'm in the fishbowl right now. Surrounded with water which is art. Do you want to be in the society.

Ocean was too scary for me. Ocean was too big and scary for me. I do enjoy the comforts that I have. Psychologically it was, uh, mentally it was [01:19:00] very, very tough. Maybe I was much younger, maybe if I tried it. Also it's very taxing on the body, like if you're standing and painting, by the evening your, um, You know, so it's not that easy.

And my medium was like oil paints and acrylic and then, but then I now pandemic I started photographing. So I do architectural photography, which I love. And people have really responded by saying that, you know, it's not just like a photograph, it's almost like a painting because I'm catching the light in a way.

And it's through my eyes that, you know, I did a photograph. I did, I roamed all over Delhi when there was, there was less traffic. I used to wake up five in the morning and go and photograph, like, I have like thousands of pictures. I'll show them to you. If you want. Yes, I'd love to. That wall where you were coming in.

Yes, that wall. And these are just few of them, but I went all over Delhi, uh, wherever I was allowed to go. And I photographed, uh, the entire city. Who will stop you? Allowed to? Where were you not allowed? But you could not [01:20:00] cross borders. And there was some red areas and. And, and, and this is like when the curfew had opened up, but they were not much traffic.

Was it tough for you during COVID? Yeah, because I used to, I actually used to go. Because you're a very social person, right? Actually, that's a misconception. I like to go to big parties, get my picture taken and leave. High five. Excellent. And I throw big parties so that I have to have minimum conversation with everybody.

Hi. Hello. Hi, hello. Hi, hello. And then after like 11, when I've done all my duties and I just go to the dance floor and dance. So I love that. Um, but, uh, but during the pandemic, like, uh, like post, this is like when the curfew had opened up and then I was shooting. It was, it was, uh, it was difficult. It was not difficult because I used to, I mean, I love the city.

And, uh, I was doing my bit, like I would [01:21:00] go and drop food in all outside hospitals or wherever. If I hadn't had photography at that time. It would be difficult for you to cope with that kind of isolation. Not isolation was not a problem. I'm very, very isolated. I'm very isolated. I don't call up people and make plans.

I go for big events. You don't do lunches. I actually go out very, very less. And most of the times you will see it's generally a shoot, which I'm doing. And I'm, but the thing for me was like, uh, people used to reach out for so many things and you could only help till a point because if the medicine or the, it was not available, It was not available.

So much was not available at the time. And there were doctors and there was a time where the second wave then actually was sending one prescription that I had got from one doctor on different chats because they were, even the doctors had fallen sick and I'm getting goosebumps. So just, uh, the going to photograph the [01:22:00] city kept me occupied in the day, uh, mentally and then doing whatever that I had to do did take strength from that creativity.

So, and that's the time also I decided to travel. It was very difficult because you had to be fully masked on the flight. Then land, uh, get yourself checked at the airport because, and the airports also, it's like they are, they get yourself checked at the airport. You have to wait for the results before you can go.

Every state had a different law. So it was not easy to travel during the pandemic. Then you, uh, go like you get cleared. You know, then the team has to get cleared. Then you travel with your whole team, like whoever wanted to, whoever felt that they were strong enough. And there was no like every, and they did want to travel.

We were taking so much precautions, whether mask, whether it was even used to do better than goggles, like I do better than goggles perpetually. And you know, whatever we could that time, we didn't know. [01:23:00] So we did all that. But traveling the country was something which, uh, really changed. changed me and that also gave me strength.

Did you ever visit, have you ever visited North East? I've been to Guwahati and You must, since you like art and stuff, I highly recommend Tawang in Arunachal. Yeah. It is a spectacular monastery. Really? It is, um, it is just beautiful. I can imagine. And I had the good fortune of being there when it had just snowed.

I will definitely. The last question is, since there is a lot of bling in your life, Yeah. And I know you have some fantastic art, like the Subodh Gupta there, who is, I know nothing about art because, but people who know about art tell me you have a fantastic collection. So there is a certain sophistication to, you know, knowing about art, being an art connoisseur.

There is certain, um, wealth comes with sophistication also, it comes with bling and [01:24:00] opulence also. For you, what is the difference in class and bling or sophistication and Being ostentatious. How, how do you distinguish that? Because you deal with so many people who are art collectors. How many of them are doing it for tax purposes?

How many are doing it by mepa? Hey, Ajo here. So, uh, and how many people Yeah, I got the question. Yeah. Yeah. So basically, uh, there are now, uh, I am asked to speak on many art panels. So they asked me this question very often is that is art an investment and what are the artists you'd like to invest in? Uh, because that has become a big thing now, investing in art is become like investing in properties or, or like, uh, wines even, you know, like, so the thing is for me, being an artist, being in the company, like my teacher in modern school was an anamolist.

Mr. He, he was friends with Al, who's a, uh, you know, who was an artist and, [01:25:00] um, Manji Ba Mm-Hmm, . So I have been in, I have met many artists, even from a young age and gone to shows. For me, artists like, it's like you love books, right? Right. What do you love? Do you like, do you like books? Yeah. Do you collect books?

They get collected. They get collected. Exactly. So, and suppose the price of book, I love football. Yeah, but you don't obviously collect ball footballs, right? Yeah. . And so the thing is that, so for me, collecting art is like for somebody who loves literature is like collecting books. And now the prices of the.

Paintings have gone up. But that's just one aspect. I'm saying generally. Yeah, so for me, generally for me collecting, for me collecting came because I, I am an artist. So it was a but natural process to collect what I love in my life, right? Like somebody who loves literature will collect books definitely, right?

So for it was very [01:26:00] natural for me. Of course, people are now doing it for various reasons, to be, to be a part of the art community, to be, to have a great portfolio, to, you know, maybe sell it later, but for me, art is purely what I see, what I love, it's, it's the, it's like a memory for me, like, I'd seen Ram Kumarji's show when I was very young, so for me, having a Ram Kumarji's painting is like, uh, it has a big association for me.

And what is class? Yeah. Class is, is a really crass word. It should not be used. Nice. At all. I didn't expect that answer at all. Class in terms of any class. Yeah. I think we just, yeah. I don't know why people do this to themselves. Nice. But it has been very interesting and revelation talking to you. Really?

so much for your time. so much. You gave us what, an hour and a half? I appreciate it. Maybe two. Yeah. But pleasure meeting you. Thank you so much. And And I look forward to your next [01:27:00] season. And I look forward, if I do interview again, you tell me that why do you have trust issues in life? I really want to know.

I want to get into that. So by the time you come next time, I would have fixed my trust issues. We shall see. Yeah, we have a work in progress. All right. Thank you for watching. I hope you enjoyed the interview. But like I always say, Watch the full unedited interview, become a subscriber of News Laundry, pay to keep news free.

We take no ads because when the public pays, the public is served. And that can only happen if you are an ad free platform that is not governed by the government. large corporations or governments. Very good. Thank you. I'm so honored to be on this platform. I'm honored that I got to interview you. Thank you.

Thank you so much.

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As Moneycontrol ‘beats ET’, HT, Express carry front page ads, ToI skips

Highest ad spending in India last year, English tops the list: Pitch Madison report

कोरोना महामारी के बीच 17 महीनों में दिल्ली सरकार ने विज्ञापन पर खर्च किए 490 करोड़

52 पेज की पाञ्चजन्य पत्रिका में 21 पन्नों पर बीजेपी सरकार का विज्ञापन

93 percent rise in print media ads: report

Diwali bonanza: TOI Delhi prints 130 pages of ads during Diwali week

दिवाली बोनांजा: अखबारों पर जमकर हुई धनवर्षा

अखबारों की समीक्षा: सिकुड़ती खबरों के बीच दानव की तरह पैर पसारते विज्ञापन

India has no legal framework to regulate cryptocurrency. So, what’s up with all the ads?

खबरों की शक्ल में विज्ञापन परोसकर पाठकों को गुमराह कर रहा अमर उजाला